No cold air--New Hunter Thermostat, Comfortmaker Heat Pump

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No cold air--New Hunter Thermostat, Comfortmaker Heat Pump

Postby bethflorida » Thu May 10, 2012 11:31 am

Hello Folks

I am new here. I have looked all over the Web for answers and have learned a lot, but my problem still isn't solved. I hope someone here can help.

PLEASE READ THESE DISCLAIMERS -

1. Yes, I know I am in over my head. (Not actually that unusual for me.)
2. Yes, I know that, if the old thermostat had been removed properly, I probably would not be posting here.
3. Yes, I know that connecting the wires on the thermostat incorrectly can damage my system.
4. Yes, I called Hunter tech support, hoping for helpful suggestions on wiring the thermostat I am installing. All the rep did was lecture me about items 1-3 above.
5. I fully understand that I should call an HVAC pro and have him fix my problem. Unfortunately, I was laid off in Feb, and have about $100 to make it for the next ten days.
6. In defense of myself, I have made certain that the thermostat is set to off and cut the power before moving wires. I have been especially cautious with the red (power) wire. At no time has an electrical breaker tripped--inside house, at the main breaker box, or the user accessible breakers on the unit itself.

WITH ALL THAT -

I have a Comfortmaker (PA55/PAPA 3 phase) Heat Pump system (electric), and want to replace my standard thermostat with one that can be programmed for energy savings. The old thermostat was a White-Rodgers 1F86-244. I am attempting to install a Hunter #44132.

I am not certain exactly how the old thermostat was wired because someone trying to help me did not mark the wires carefully, relying instead on memory. Enough said.

So, here is what I did in hooking up the Hunter programmable thermostat. There are two switches on the circuit board (back of display). I set them for electric and heat pump.

Five wires come out of the wall. Red, yellow, green, white, and blue.

a. The wiring connection diagram from the heat pump's manual indicates that
red (power) goes to RC, */RC *
yellow(compressor) to Y,
green (fan) to G,
white (elec heat acc) to W,
and blue (com) to C

b. The instructions that came with the thermostat are not very helpful in my situation, and I have already mentioned that tech support was a waste of time. The closest diagram to my system is for a multi-stage heat pump. It shows connections for eight wires instead of the five I have. If I have sorted the information properly, this is what the thermostat's instructions -
red to RC */RC *
yellow to Y
green to G
white to Aux/E
and blue to O

I have tried both these configurations, as well as configurations placing the blue wire at B rather than O. In all cases, I received the same result.

--When I move the selector from off to cool, I hear a click and an icon of a fan appears on the display. My system has a delay, but after that delay, the blower starts up, sending a good volume of air through the registers. The problem is that the air is not cooled. It is ambient temp, not heated by the unit.

--I haven't tested the heat function today, but it seemed to work fine last night. (I waited to test it until after the ambient air temp was below 85 F.)

So, I am trapped in my bedroom, where I have a window AC unit. It is 89 F in my living room right now. Needless to say, I haven't gotten many chores done today.

I am considering opening up the HVAC unit in order to see how the low voltage wires are connected at the unit. I would, of course, turn off all power to the unit before I even find my screwdriver. Any thoughts on whether this step is likely to be useful?

I would very much appreciate any suggestions that might get me out of this mess. If what I have written convinces you that I have fried my AC, is there some test or observation that would confirm said friedness?

Thanks in advance.
Beth
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- No cold air--New Hunter Thermostat, Comfortmaker Heat Pu

Postby heatseeker » Thu May 10, 2012 3:00 pm

not fried, if you must just unhook the reversing vlv wire at the t-stat and see if it goes into cool. is your condenser even working?
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Postby bethflorida » Fri May 11, 2012 11:29 am

I took a look at the outside unit. I believe my capacitor is blown.

More later.
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Postby heatseeker » Fri May 11, 2012 12:58 pm

What gives you the impression that the cap is blown?
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Postby bethflorida » Fri May 11, 2012 2:11 pm

It is bulging unevenly at the top
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Postby heatseeker » Fri May 11, 2012 3:09 pm

That a good sign but why did you assume the t stat was bad?
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Postby bethflorida » Sat May 12, 2012 11:31 am

I never assumed the thermostat was bad. The original goal was simply to replace a standard thermostat with a programmable one, hoping to reduce electric bills.

My initial problem was that I did not have a reliable list of how the original thermostat was connected. (Which wires went where.) So I connected the wires based on color. When I connected the new thermostat using the "standard", color to same color pattern, it seemed to work fine. But when the air started to blow through the registers, it was not cool. (I did try out the heat function very briefly, and it seems OK. Hard to know with 100% certainty, given that it is already 90+ degrees here, and can get even hotter in my place.)

Still hoping that my problem was just that one or more of the wires to the thermostat had been connected at the unit to a different color wire. I opened the unit to check out the wiring. (BTW, no breakers have blown at any time.) For some reason, the yellow thermostat wire has been cut intentionally and is not connected to anything. The yellow wire from the heat pump is connected to the blue thermostat wire. I believe that means I should connect the blue wire where the yellow wire normally goes and not connect the yellow thermostat wire to anything. If I am wrong, don't hesitate to say so.

While I had the unit open, I set the rewired thermostat to cool, but the outside fan only hummed and did not spin at all. When I checked the capacitor, the top looked like there had been an internal explosion. The top was rounded but lopsided with bulges. From what I know, that is pretty much the definition of a bad capacitor. Using multiple safety measures, I removed the capacitor. Unfortunately, so far I have not been able to find an HVAC supplier willing to sell me a replacement part. Guess I will buy one online and just wait a few more days for cool air.
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- No cold air--New Hunter Thermostat, Comfortmaker Heat Pu

Postby Freon » Sun May 13, 2012 1:30 pm

I don't think you've fried anything. Definitely replace the condenser capacitor with one that's identical. Pull the main disconnect to the condenser and you should be fine. Until you have the compressor working properly, you'll never really know if lack of cooling is due to the thermostat or a sick compressor.

Next I suggest you trace your thermostat wires to the air handler. Where they connect you should, hopefully, see letter designations for each terminal connection. Usually, but not always, the wire color corresponds to the terminal. But repairs and splices over the years can mess that up. Look at the way the old WR thermostat was wired here "" *.*/en-US/resources/faq/white_rodgers/Documents/0037-6174.pdf"" on page 3 (after the -. type in *) or google White-Rodgers 1F86-244 and look for the pdf file from emersonclimate.

I believe the blue wire may be the reversing valve since the old WR thermostat shows no common connection. Again, check at the air handler.

If that's the case, you need to determine whether heating or cooling is the mode when the reversing valve is energized (has 24 volts). In the WR diagram they show a B and an O terminal on the WR thermostat but your new thermostat may have only one connection terminal for the reversing valve and there will be a place in the thermostat setup where you tell the thermostat to energize the reversing valve on heating or cooling.
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- No cold air--New Hunter Thermostat, Comfortmaker Heat Pu

Postby bethflorida » Fri May 18, 2012 9:19 am

Folks

I have cold air again!

Could not find any local supplier who would sell me the capacitor, so I had to wait a couple of days for internet purchase. It took me just a couple of minutes to replace, because I had carefully labeled the wires before I removed the old capacitor.

I did have to substitute the blue wire for the yellow wire at the thermostat, because the yellow wire was cut short and not connected to anything at the air handler. (The blue thermostat wire was connected to the yellow unit wire.) BTW, can any one think of a legit reason for doing that switch?

I would not have been able to make this repair so confidently without the advice from this group. I am most appreciative. Without a paycheck coming in, calling an HVAC service was not an option.

Thanks again.

Beth
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- No cold air--New Hunter Thermostat, Comfortmaker Heat Pu

Postby heatseeker » Fri May 18, 2012 11:14 am

Beth I here you calling --ha ha-- T-stat wires have no official wire code so you can make it up as you go. Good job eh. That is interesting how no distributors would sell you a contacter, around here they will sell you just about anything.
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